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Well, ok, Vegas... Well... You would have me there! Except that the ATF in FOIA requrest reported that they were aware of no crimes that involved bump stocks [0]

Aside from that, I could probably ask how the media was confidently able to report bump stocks were used - but that NOT A SINGLE official report or released info mentions them as being used. Only media coverage.

Everyone should be extremely skepical of the extreme limited amount of confirmed information released on Vegas. Not implying any sort of conspiracy at all, but there is clearly something atypical with that event.

But hey, maybe the ATF and the Criminal Enforcement System of Records is wrong!

[0] http://www.captainsjournal.com/2019/05/01/foia-response-from...

edit: For additional info on Vegas. The ATF says up front they were never authorized to examine the firearms in the Las Vegas shooting (highly irregular). They can't say they were R/DIAS, Lightening links, illegal sear conversions, crank trigger, bump stocks or just shot quickly. [1] That data on still should have been added to and appeared the CESR though, which it does not.

My personal opinion is that the photos released show bipods - Bump stocks don't work from bipods!

[1] https://waronguns.blogspot.com/2019/04/about-those-bump-stoc...



Since you seem to know more about this than I do: could one deduce what was used from the audio recordings that I'm sure lots of people have made? I imagine some combination of rate of fire and pauses between bursts and other factors could tell if it was "real" full-auto fire.


I listened to the audio a handful of times. There is so much echo and microphone clipping that I couldn't determine.

I agreed with bump stock at first because it did seem to be erratic timing. It didn't seem like real auto. But after a few more listens, it's hard to tell, the echo gets really confusing.

I've been on ranges that I would swear a guy has a burst trigger pack but it's usually just echo or some effect of the supersonic crack and/or shooter's position under canopy.

The ATF did say there were no sear hole for a real auto trigger sear/group. An R/DIAS or Lightening link should have a fairly stable rate, but not always. There is typically a some tuning that goes into those per lower (shims, machining, glue, etc).

I'd absolutely believe trigger crank over bump stock. That was it ended up sounding like to me. Seemingly increasing ROF then stop.

IDK. If you set me down on a bipod, I bet I could fire as fast as that video with a competition trigger. It would sound similarly sporadic to what was in the video, for what that's worth! I guess that's the larger point, even if it was bump stocks, it didn't make much of a difference.

I'm skeptical of the things not mentioned in that event. But, I just know the photo released showed bipod rifles at the window and bump stocks don't work well with bipods. You need the gun to recoil into your finger which means it can't be supported / attached to ground at the handguard.




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