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"And nope, Signal doesn't make the cut for the above reasons because it exposes your phone number to everyone else"

This is being worked on.

The thing is you're mixing two threat models. One is a creepy dude who will give you nightly calls if they learn your phone number. The other is a state actor who will hack the server and track you based on your IP-address if no phone number is being used otherwise: hence the enumeration attacks won't matter. You can't escape state actors looking at your metadata with Wire, Element or Signal. For that you want an Onion Service based system like Briar, Cwtch, Ricochet, or TFC.

For the creepy people not having to hand out your phone number is a nicety, but it's not at all hard to block a phone number either, it works just like any other app's blacklist: just add the number and be done with it.



The "thing" is they're "mixing two threat models"? What does that mean?

I feel like they have 1 threat model and the "thing" is you're trying to decompose it into a mixture of black and white....


phone numbers are shared in groups with tens of thousands of people. They spam, herass, hack etc. Forcing you to change your number.


Ah yes, the classic hacking someone with their phone number!


they sent phishing links thru sms and also do sim swaps. They hijack the phone number by connecting it to another sim card. They also have people work at the providers that give them access to these numbers. I'm in those groups so I'm not talking out of my ass.


yes? just knowing a phone number is enough to log into a non-2fa google account if you know the pass, plus it can be easily triangulated to a real-world address


exactly. And not only that, people who work at telecom providers sell illegal services to whoever wants to pay. They give you access to anyones numbers for money.




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