(Though the whole thing, while useful in practice, feels like essentially a workaround for unnecessarily heavy and app-centric UIs. Having both an “Open” command and an “Open, but faster and does less” command feels like humans succumbing to the needs of computers, not computers providing an additional convenience for humans. But that is a much more complicated problem that I don’t think has ever been solved in a GUI context.)
> Though the whole thing, while useful in practice, feels like essentially a workaround for unnecessarily heavy and app-centric UIs.
Right, I'm sometimes puzzled by how people approach their personal "deal-breakers" that prevent Mac->Lin (or Win->Lin) switch. Many of the issues are presented as though they are bugs or clear-cut missing features, but are in fact subjective preference statements.
In this case the "spacebar to preview" feature might be a must-have for some, but to others it might not be important, and maybe even to some be perceived as an anti-feature. I personally see this particular feature as redundant (given there is already thumbnailing and a means to open files) and unintuitive, and thus just more clutter. But I also don't care too much, since I could always disable it if it came pre-enabled.
The worst cases of this is when some insist that not only is their particular preference the The One Way, but that stubborn Linux DE developers are somehow at fault for not implementing The One Way, and that's why Linux will never be popular. There are plenty of things that might keep "normies" from switching, but random obscure DE features are not them. People tolerate FAR worse UX disasters than any major Linux DE.
I always feel like I'm in a different plane from the rest of the universe when discussing these things.
When I read how Linux DEs are "obviously" garbage, I just generally throw up a thought bubble with few question marks above my head in confusion and go on with my day. I find Mac OS a frustrating experience personally, but assume it's mostly a result of not being used to it.
> I find Mac OS a frustrating experience personally, but assume it's mostly a result of not being used to it.
I used it at my previous job, 2014-18 -- got the choice between a Mac and IIRC a ThinkPad when I started, and never having used a Mac before I wanted to finally try it -- and got a MacBook Pro, can't recall the vintage. Broke the screen a couple years later, got a 2016. But, anyway: Took a while to get used to the OS, and certainly didn't feel all that "super-intuitive" as the hype has had it for all these years.
So, observation #1: If I could get used to it (and I got quite comfortable after a while), I can't see why people can't go the other way just as easily.
Can't recall the OS version at the beginning (one of the last of the big cats, or some US body of water?), but later it upgraded via various Californian (or Oregon, Washington?) rivers or lakes to Maverick and finally, I think (for the last few months), to El Capitan. Can't recall if it set in right away, but after a couple of years at the latest I noticed the same thing as many here have mentioned, namely
Observation #2: With every new version, the OS gets a little more limited and locked down.
> I always feel like I'm in a different plane from the rest of the universe when discussing these things.
Exactly! It really feels like there's this massive disconnect in these conversations that I can't explain.
Whenever I have to use macOS, I'm a complete mess, and to me like it's missing basic features and doesn't support my workflow without lots of 3rd party add-ons, etc. That said, I probably am using it wrong, so I don't go around saying that macOS desktop is obviously garbage. I know that other people prefer this style, so that's A-OK.
It reminds me an article from the author of Paul Buchheit (gmail's creator), when he was beta testing it internally with Google employees.
Many of them were asking for email preview popups directly from the inbox. Instead of implementing it, he realized the need wasn't for a popup but for a wait to see your email quickly. The real issue was that it was slow when you clicked on an email, so he made it fast instead.
> Right, I'm sometimes puzzled by how people approach their personal "deal-breakers" that prevent Mac->Lin (or Win->Lin) switch. Many of the issues are presented as though they are bugs or clear-cut missing features, but are in fact subjective preference statements.
Since preference is pretty important, does it really matter? If they have a workflow they like and no significant pressure to change, why would they? You speak as though it is everyone's most pressing goal to transition to Linux Desktop for some reason.
> The worst cases of this is when some insist that not only is their particular preference the The One Way, but that stubborn Linux DE developers are somehow at fault for not implementing The One Way, and that's why Linux will never be popular.
There's a lot of reasons Linux will never be popular, developers ignoring the workflows and use cases of potential users is just one of them. The condescending attitude of many of its supposed proponents is another. Why would I want to switch to a Desktop that's as clunky and haphazard as Windows 10, just in different ways that I have to relearn?
>Having both an “Open” command and an “Open, but faster and does less” command
>I personally see this particular feature as redundant (given there is already thumbnailing and a means to open files)
I'm guessing neither of you have actually used QuickLook and/or don't use apps like Photoshop or Illustrator which, even on a fast SSD equipped laptop can take around 30 seconds to open. QuickLook is much more than just a preview.
When I'm browsing a folder of my image files and can't remember which of dozens of files is the one I actually want, QuickLook lets me pop open a screen sized modal preview window, which is as good as having that file open in the app. If it's not the file I'm looking for, I hit the up or down arrows and the next or previous file's content is displayed in the already open preview popup. If some of those other image files were created by Illustrator, I've just saved myself an additional ~30 seconds, by not having to open that app too. And, once I find the image I want, I can open it in its associated app directly from a button in the top of the preview pane.
But, even if you're not a graphic designer, QuickLook has its uses for other types of document too. It can preview the content of source code files [with syntax highlighting] preview the rendered output of things like HTML, PDF, Markdown, AsciiDoc etc. You can even scroll through the pages of a multipage document.
This is another timesaver I use all the time. Being able to check the date or bottom line on a received PDF invoice, without opening it... being able to check whether I mentioned something in a letter I sent, without firing up a text editor or word processor... being able to see a rendered representation of what an HTML file contains... etc. etc.
No, that’s not what I meant. I do in fact use the previewer I linked to, and would be worse off without it.
I just think that it the apps that make it necessary shouldn’t do so: if Photoshop (or GIMP, or LibreOffice, or whatever) takes 30 seconds to open a file, the solution shouldn’t be to layer on yet another option and make me think whether I want to suffer that delay or reduced functionality, it should be to eliminate the delay.
Yet (as I’ve also said) I don’t think anybody came up with a plausible way to do so (even a purely technical one, disregarding economic incentives for app developers).
Evince is also pretty snappy. Not as omnivorous, but let’s be honest, most of my hard drive is PDFs.
Quickly flipping between files with horizontal arrows (or something of a similar complexity) is actually the more interesting function here, I think, and maybe it does warrant a mode. Some picture viewers try to make the switch implicit (flip between files when picture fits on screen, pan horizontally when not), but my builtin mode tracker gets out of sync frequently, and I would absolutely hate to have the same error-prone controls in a PDF viewer, where I sometimes stare at a single file for hours and sometimes flip through a dozen in a minute. No idea how this should be done.
First off, thanks for the great reply! My point isn't that it's not useful as much as that it's very preference-based. The good news is though that apparently both Linux (GNOME + KDE) and macOS support this feature, despite my not using it much on any platform, so it's what we're discussing is not even a difference between mac/lin at this point, but just an abstract consideration.
> Being able to check the date or bottom line on a received PDF invoice, without opening it.
I tried double-clicking on a 43-page PDF, and it took less than a second to open on my under-powered Acer (about ~$200, mfg 4 years ago), running stock Ubuntu 20.04. This seems really fast, as it was basically instantaneous from releasing the mouse. Obviously opening up a PSD would be slower, but then again I can always just zoom in on the thumbnail in that case (Ctrl+Scroll zooms in on icons in Linux).
This is making me think perhaps the real difference is that the default programs that open are too slow, eg if Photoshop is the default associated application for all images, or Adobe Acrobat for all PDFs, then I totally would see the need to have a previewer as well, since last time I used those they were realllllly slow.
I dunno, that said, it's all really not important. Then again, what is HN but for getting grumpy about unimportant things? :p
A preview pane isn't exactly the same thing. OSX also has this in column view. But Quicklook will popup a modal window, which can be resized as big as you want, so you can get a clear view of the file content as good as actually opening it in its app, without the added overhead of actually having to launch [and quit] that app.
[and, if the file in question is a Photoshop or Illustrator document, you'll really appreciate how much time QuickLook saves you, by not having to wait for those behemoths to creak slowly into action]
There are also certain plugins which can enhance this functionality by providing extra info, such as pixel dimensions on image files, allowing browsing inside archives, syntax highlighting of source code files etc.
Maybe peoples' descriptions on here aren't doing Quicklook justice, for those who aren't familiar with it. Once you've used it for a while, you can't imagine why it's not a standard feature on any modern desktop OS.
It's not hidden in a disused lavatory behind a sign bearing the words "beware the leopard". Click menu button view panels "Information" Also F11
If remembers the state globally so if you leave it open it will always be there when you open a file manager window if you toggle it off it will be hidden next time too.
It's not open by default perhaps because not everyone regards it as maximally useful. Say I open a file manager and have it sized to 1/4 of a 24" 1080p screen. On the left hand side of the screen is a panel which lists common and places and other items. This leaves a space for 15 icons on the screen at 48px size big enough to comfortably read and note some details in a preview.
Opening the information pane reduces that to 10 icons greatly reducing the space available for the main purpose of the application.
What if I open it to the full size of the screen? I can now view 56 icons at 80px where now they actually are a pretty decent size to see whats in them in their own icon.
I think most of the time having the info panel shown would decrease the utility of the window.
> It's not open by default perhaps because not everyone regards it as maximally useful.
Indeed, I don't have any use for information or preview panes, I disable them all when encountering. IMHO they are a distraction from the content itself and make the view arrangement clumsy.
KDE's file manager has a previewpane that you can enable if you wish.