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Again saying something exists is not a rebuttal to why it exists. Also, any intuitive feeling I have that something is random is irrelevant when discussing how something is not random.

Put it this way. Ask any atheist why we have religion in the world and they'll generally give you the same answer. Humans have a need to put order to the universe so they invent benevolent deitys to give them that sense of order.

But if we discover, as we gain more and more knowledge through science, that there in fact is an order to the universe doesn't that least SUGGEST that MAYBE there is a higher power?



As a theist I have to disagree with your final point. The presence of order in our universe is very clearly necessary in order for us to be able to question the existence of order. That the weak anthropic principle is and always will be a sufficient explanation of the presence of order does not undermine my personal sense of faith, but nothing about the presence of order supports it.


It is difficult to talk about these things when we use the same words to mean very different things. What do you mean by random? I am surrounded by random events, each little flash of light arrives at random, but overall the light in my room is largley uniform, certainly predictable.

So, no, that the light from my lamp comes out in all directions does not suggest to me a higher power.


Think of it this way: Chaos and order are on different side of the same coin.

If there's no randomness and chaos, life wouldn't probably form. There wouldn't be the billion, or trillion of random cominbation that finally form the foundation of life. There wouldn't be any order to recongnize because the universe is inert. There would be nothing to see and nothing to do. Likewise, if there is no energy difference between different area of the universe, the structure of life couldn't form.

Why do spontangeous order exists? Because without spontangeous orders nothing can exists and no life would form. It doesn't need a reason, because its reason is to exist.

In other words, randomness is neccessary for the creation of an anthrophic universe. For that I am a discordian.

Of course, I am not a philosopher.


Again saying something exists is not a rebuttal to why it exists.

Of course those abstractions exists. An abstraction can't not exist.

What you actually mean to disagree with is the application of the abstraction to life or to the cosmos or to whatever you are worked up about here.

But, I never said you need to apply these abstractions to anything. I'm not interested in explaining the world to you in a internet comment.

I'm simply observing you do not understand the idea of spontaneous order and suggesting you take the time to think about it.




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